Hammerhead barrels, and their lies!

[SlartyBartFast]

but again IMHO, it does put a spin on the ball that a smooth bore barrel does not, like an armson..

Then sorry, but you don't know what you're talking about.

TK tested spinning PBs. It did absolutely NOTHING for accuracy. and that was at thousands of RPM.

Not only have all barrel companies failed to show that they impart any spin what-so-ever, let alone a consistent one, the rifling and lengths would impart a negligeable spin even if one was imparted.

[RRfireblade]

I'll just jump in here real quick and say Armson Rifled Barrels do not create spin nor are they intended too.

Back to your regularly schedule broadcast.

[PumpPlayer]

No offense here, but those archived threads not particularly relevant to the discussion nor is it short enough that anyone could have a hope of reading it in a timely manner.

I've shot hammerheads, I've seen them shot and I've talked with the reps and one of the company owners. From my experience, they were all stand-up people that were simply trying to sell their products. Yes, there's some exaggeration going on, but they are trying to make money and from my experience, they do not do so unethically. I wish I could say the same about all paintball product manufacturers.

On the science side of things, the fin length as well as the ported length is the same for both the 8" and 12" versions of the hammerhead. The extra 4" is all rifling. If spin on the ball breaks down the boundary layer and decreases friction and the length of rifled barrel increases the spin, then a longer barrel WOULD result in a further flight. Question here - did the rep say, "A 12" barrel shoots further than an 8" barrel." or did he say, "OUR 12" barrel shoots further than OUR 8" barrel."? Clearly there's a big difference between the two statements. Regardless, you are a jerk for interrupting someone on their turf talking about their product. Personally I think he let you off easy.

Lastly - to all you flatline/Z-body people. It only works above about 25k rpm. Any less than that it actually hurts. Why? There is an "anti-magnus effect" so to speak. The ball actually moves away from the "fast" side in order to seek the path of least resistance. Until the magnus effect overcomes the additional friction on the "fast" side - backspin actually hurts. Backspin at low rpm pushes the ball down because it "pulls" the air over top of it. In fact, topspin at low rpm (say about 10k) causes the balls to "climb" the air. (Think of spin in ping-pong) Only when you break the barrier at about 25k rpm does backspin have a desirable effect. Obviously, the flatline does work and so does the z-body. But if you'll notice - they don't work below a certain velocity (obviously since it's friction-induced spin, higher velocity equates to higher rate of spin). Spin of less than 3k rpm does almost nothing to a pantball no matter how it is applied. Rifled barrels even with no slip, the twist is so shallow that the spin would be less than 8 rpm regardless of manufacturer - hardly affecting trajectory in the least.

The hammerhead doesn't make paintballs more accurate by applying axial spin - rifling does nothing because it's not fast enough. However, it may be more accurate because a controlled axial spin is generated versus an uncontrollable spin. If you look at the twist (it's very shallow), you'll note that even at high velocity, the most the ball spins is about 6k to 8k rpm. Hardly enough to do anything, but it MAY prevent uncontrolled spin from developing. That's all. I personally think the Hammerheads shoot better than a lot of systems out there (I wouldn't say all) and for the machining involved, it's worth the price. It's expensive for the performance it gives, but it's not expensive for the machining and the quality of product you get.


Incidentally - I had the opportunity to shoot a 12" hammerhead on a z-body just yesterday. VERY interesting. The z-body is great - the balls just "float" well past the range where they should otherwise land (if you have never seen a z-body they really do work). With the hammerhead on it though, the balls corkscrew ever so slightly to the right. It's not enough that you could shoot around a bunker with and it is very consistent and predictable, but it's a good 2' deviation at 150'. Very interesting even if incredibly impractical.


Bottom line - The hammerhead's a good barrel though not necessarily the best and still very expensive. Even still - there was no reason to interrupt a sales rep and tell him he was wrong for making claims about his own product. Take caution the next time you decide to call someone out in front of a customer.

If you're out with your buddies, would you walk over to one of your friends who is speaking with a lady, interrupt him and tell the lady how much of a jerk your friend is? Well, you pretty much did just that...

[Jonno06]

the 12" does go farther.......by 4"s.

[Jack & Coke]

the 12" does go farther.......by 4"s.

actually it's "shorter"

think tip of barrel to target

[hitech]

No offense here, but those archived threads not particularly relevant to the discussion nor is it short enough that anyone could have a hope of reading it in a timely manner.

Yes they are. And that is the problem with attempting to "prove" the point. You have to be willing to learn...

[PekngDuk rndCrnz]

hmmm...

from what I know about basic physics...wouldnt spin on the ball make it LESS accurate?
Because of the Magnus Effect, the spin of the ball would create an imbalance on the ball's boundary layer. Due to the spin, one side of the rotating sphere would have a greater static pressure than on the other side. Robin's law dictates that a rapidly spinning projectile will have another force at right angles to it's spin axis.

I dont know ALOT about physics, but if the barrel made the ball spin counterclockwise, for example, wouldn't the ball have a slight curve to the left?

[Eric Of Extreme Measures]

HAMMERHEADS SUCK!

Im selling one on Ebay if any one is interested!!! Good Price!

Eric

[Lohman446]

This is good.. lets disect this

No offense here, but those archived threads not particularly relevant to the discussion nor is it short enough that anyone could have a hope of reading it in a timely manner.

I know there are mountains of quantitative data taken in a pretty well controlled way that debunk all the things I am going to say. So lets ignore them.

I've shot hammerheads, I've seen them shot and I've talked with the reps and one of the company owners. From my experience, they were all stand-up people that were simply trying to sell their products. Yes, there's some exaggeration going on, but they are trying to make money and from my experience, they do not do so unethically. I wish I could say the same about all paintball product manufacturers.

Its ok to flat out lie to consumers in order to get there money. This is not fraudulent or anything. Its just business

On the science side of things, the fin length as well as the ported length is the same for both the 8" and 12" versions of the hammerhead. The extra 4" is all rifling. If spin on the ball breaks down the boundary layer and decreases friction and the length of rifled barrel increases the spin, then a longer barrel WOULD result in a further flight. Question here - did the rep say, "A 12" barrel shoots further than an 8" barrel." or did he say, "OUR 12" barrel shoots further than OUR 8" barrel."? Clearly there's a big difference between the two statements. Regardless, you are a jerk for interrupting someone on their turf talking about their product. Personally I think he let you off easy.

Yeh.. because that rifling after the control bore... doesn' touch the ball. What good can it be? And yes.. our barrel takes away all physics, imparts a sphere of anti-gravitational material around your ball, and makes it shoot further..

Lastly - to all you flatline/Z-body people. It only works above about 25k rpm. Any less than that it actually hurts. Why? There is an "anti-magnus effect" so to speak. The ball actually moves away from the "fast" side in order to seek the path of least resistance. Until the magnus effect overcomes the additional friction on the "fast" side - backspin actually hurts. Backspin at low rpm pushes the ball down because it "pulls" the air over top of it. In fact, topspin at low rpm (say about 10k) causes the balls to "climb" the air. (Think of spin in ping-pong) Only when you break the barrier at about 25k rpm does backspin have a desirable effect. Obviously, the flatline does work and so does the z-body. But if you'll notice - they don't work below a certain velocity (obviously since it's friction-induced spin, higher velocity equates to higher rate of spin). Spin of less than 3k rpm does almost nothing to a pantball no matter how it is applied. Rifled barrels even with no slip, the twist is so shallow that the spin would be less than 8 rpm regardless of manufacturer - hardly affecting trajectory in the least.

So the flatline does not shoot further.. or around corners..

Incidentally - I had the opportunity to shoot a 12" hammerhead on a z-body just yesterday. VERY interesting. The z-body is great - the balls just "float" well past the range where they should otherwise land (if you have never seen a z-body they really do work). With the hammerhead on it though, the balls corkscrew ever so slightly to the right. It's not enough that you could shoot around a bunker with and it is very consistent and predictable, but it's a good 2' deviation at 150'. Very interesting even if incredibly impractical.

Ok, teh Z-body and flatline actually do work.. but only when used with our barrel?

Bottom line - The hammerhead's a good barrel though not necessarily the best and still very expensive. Even still - there was no reason to interrupt a sales rep and tell him he was wrong for making claims about his own product. Take caution the next time you decide to call someone out in front of a customer.

If you're out with your buddies, would you walk over to one of your friends who is speaking with a lady, interrupt him and tell the lady how much of a jerk your friend is? Well, you pretty much did just that...

Why... I might do it nicer, by asking how, but theres no reason to get away with crap like that. As to taking caution... please - going to attack me because I called your lie a lie. No big deal. As to the friend analogy... theres a difference - he's trying to commit fraud for physical acts.. not for money.

[Archangel Zer0]

I've shot hammerheads, I've seen them shot and I've talked with the reps and one of the company owners. From my experience, they were all stand-up people that were simply trying to sell their products. Yes, there's some exaggeration going on, but they are trying to make money and from my experience, they do not do so unethically. I wish I could say the same about all paintball product manufacturers.

If you're out with your buddies, would you walk over to one of your friends who is speaking with a lady, interrupt him and tell the lady how much of a jerk your friend is? Well, you pretty much did just that...

Lying isn't the same thing as exaggerating. Hammerhead lies about their product. Unethically and unequivocally. They claim their system is more accurate, has a tighter ball grouping, is quieter, is lighter, and is more tolerant of different quality paints than any other barrel. Look at their website. I see that they took down the "shoots itself clean in 3 shots" lie.

And if one of my buddies is talking to a chick that I caught gonorrhea from, I'll sure go over and tell him that she's unclean before he ends up the same way. Hammerhead is the unclean chick with the clap and I'm just trying to make sure that the guys on AO don't catch it, too.

[overkill8000]

yeah he is full of it i think that its more your preference. personally i like a longer barrel b/c their quiter, more air efficent, wrap bunkers better, and they look nicer to me. but as for accuracy and distance, mmmmmmmmmmmmm i dont think so. oh yeah and if u want a real opion try a website like this 9 out of 10 it'll be a true. of course thell try to sell u a longer barrel they make more money.

[overkill8000]

HAMMERHEADS SUCK!

Im selling one on Ebay if any one is interested!!! Good Price!

Eric

nice sell pitch lol..........

[vonort]

If it wasnt Robert that you were talking who. Who was it? Just curious.

[WARPED1]

So I guess you think that there shouldn't be a better business bureau or a consumer protection office then..

Bad business NEED to be interfered with. Snake oil salesmen NEED to be stopped.

If they don't like it, too bad. They have to live with the concequences of the unethical business model they've chosen to persue.

Nice Slarty, and I agree.

[Eric Of Extreme Measures]

nice sell pitch lol..........

LOLOLOL

They do, and I am, if you like them, you can have them....

To Each his own. I am not going to get started...again.

The Stiffi, even worst, selling them off too, good price, LOL


http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...spagename=STRK

Id like to throw it in the lake, #*^%@^*@**$(#, or give it to the sales person we are talking about, right up his KAZOO, sideways and teach him a thing about inerta!
Eric

[CodeMA]

...wow... I gotta say yall know how to slam a company and the good name of people you dont even know nor have never met...good job...


Colin, the actual owner of Hammerhead as well as Offical Paintball of Texas and their various lines of products is a standup guy and cool as hell... YOU dont know him YOU damn sure shouldnt be bashing him like you guys are... not cool

NOW... the barrels, I personally prefer kits with a short control barrel, IE hammerheads, stiffis, etc... I will also say I have converted sevral people over the years to my way of thinking, I know yall are set in your ways and are all over Newton and everyone else who has ever done some sort of testings balls and me throwing a couple paragraphs of text that may or may not go against some of this prolly isnt going to change this...but I feel the need to stick up for one of my sponors who is getting bashed for the simple fact his barrels seem to go against what YOU have been told for years online...

So, Ive seen the progression of these barrels over the years, shot on every gun on the market practicly, with just about every brand of paint as well... Im not here to say they add x ammount of range, and always shoot perfect through paint and crap... cuz they dont stright up...

I am here to say they are sweet barrels that are more forgiving on not so great paint, have a constant tragectory at both short and long distances, less down range sound(not that it matters to much, but for those that think it does, and its just plain cool LOL) It DOES shoot ok through breaks, better then most(new gen battle stik expecially)

Specifics: well honed short bore= less distance for warped/dimpled paint to hangup and bust, less chops .... Preformance loss, nothing nominal, it has the seal needed and thats it, very well machined short control bore... If you want to say my above thoughts on that are bs, back it up saying you have PERSONALLY used both with the same paint, same gun, same paint to bore match....if not then DFT

Rifleing: Added physical distance? Not really nominal, but it does look like it... The way the tips are designed with a larger diamater and a very minimal twist with the rifleing DOES seem to stableize the ball at all ranges, but namely across the field. As a backplayers, every edge I can get, Im going to utilize and with the Hammerhead its a fairly decent edge when trying to put balls on someones face from 180esh feet away. I cant even say this is all due to the rifleing, the muzzle break doesnt have rifleing on it with the battle stik, and has an even larger diamiter, which is claimed to recharge the residual pressure behind the ball... Now for the physic minded people here, lets look at the pillow effect of the low pressure guns that the air has behind the ball(this is the stuff that makes your marker still shoot paint and not blow it to hell if your LPR fails, generally puting your FPS in thigh mid 500s, still leaving the ball intact and shooting really really fast(ie through a pod full of paint, a pack, and into someones back) and then logicly(as flawed as you may claim it to be) would stand to say the barrels design utlizes this... I have noticed LP markers getting more out of the hammerhead then high pressure guns, though they still do get some preformance gain here, and deffently from the short control bore/wider inner diamitater of the barrel...

Converting people to the hammerhead:

Ive had the pleasure of promoteing these barrels over the years, and carry a full fin kit and an extra tip in autococker threading and have got a fair share of people to go out and buy a hammerhead kit after getting them to shoot one for the day... I (as I did here) try to stay away from the card carrying Hammerhead point sheet...and let the barrel speak for it self... The guys at Hammerhead or any of there dealers wil do the same...
One of the more recent instances of this:
I work at a field in North Central Texas, PMI based... The owners son is hardcore evil this, evil that... and truely loves his pipe kit... swares its the best barrel out there has for years... Well he didnt have it at the field one day and was asking around for a good barrel and was shooting some really brittle ultra evil that was slightly swollen and warped and was old... So being the nice guy that I am, sized some of his paint and let him use my spare tip and a fin... He went out and put a hopper through his gun with the hammerhead on it, came back in smileing and all excited... without even plugging the barrel, he noticed a diffrence, only thing I told him is that it was a great barrel and had sized the paint for him and to go shoot faces... In the first set of games, his longball game improved dramaticly and he wasnt chopping like he was with his pipe kit (also sized) or a boomstick he had used before I let him barrow the hammerhead (also no fitting issues with the boomstick, I checked for peice of mind) He seriously noticed a big diffrence and it showed both through his actions on the field and reactions to them... I bet I ended up sending 3 people to Offical to buy a hammerhead that day and almost looseing my barrel LOL





For those not wanting to read my long post(most likely riddled with typos)
F* Smacktalk
Hammerhead barrels do most of what they say, there not perfect and it could very well be dependant on marker variables
Unless you shoot a hammerhead kit for the day, properly sized, preferably along side another kit with properly sized paint, and test it in actual play, not over a chrono or whatever, just play.... If you think the barrel sucks after that, and dont notice anything diffrent in the way it appers to effect balls and your game...THEN you can come up and say something, but if you just want to go on what others have said and base your posts and opinions on poor wording from sales reps and such, you have no right to say ANYTHING...

So, go try the kit, if it doesnt preform in a fasion compareable to what they say...you prolly dont know how to size paint/setup your marker or are too stuck up on what youve been told by everyone else...

[frop]

I just don't believe the rifling hype that gets thrown out from time to time. I don't know if it's a quality piece or not, since it IS $300. For $300 it damn well better be quality. I'm more incline to believe that any improvements are because of quality, not necessarily rifling.

To those saying the extra 4" causes the ball the spin faster, it shouldn't. If full effect isn't achieved in 8", then they are selling an inferior product and should berated for that.

[Aliens-8-MyDad]

In the first set of games, his longball game improved dramaticly and he wasnt chopping like he was with his pipe kit (also sized) or a boomstick

how does a barrel prevent chops?

I do remember you shooting the hammer head at our little ao day thingy and it was decently accuarte, not bad, but nothing special IMO on par with my boomy. I just got my lucky 15 kit and jeezus that is the most accuarate barrel Ive used. its better than the boomstick and as light as an ultralight. it shoots well through breaks too.

Lucky15>all other barrels/kits

and if you dont belive me, ask blazestorm or someone else with a lucky 15 kit

[Duzzy]

So here is my random thought...

Let's just pretend they shoot the gun first with an 8 inch barrel on it. Then they only change the barrel and put a 12 inch on it and shoot it.

So here is my question. Assuming that the gun shoots different distances in this scenario, and assuming this is their test, are they really lying if they say one barrel shoots farther than another?

Because if you create the right scenario the 12 inch barrel may actually shoot farther because the velocity won't be as high with the 8 inch barrel. Sure it may be misleading but is it an outright lie?

[RRfireblade]

Hear's the real question....

Anyone yet seen any actual 'proof' that they even spin the paintball at all?

[personman]

Because if you create the right scenario the 12 inch barrel may actually shoot farther because the velocity won't be as high with the 8 inch barrel. Sure it may be misleading but is it an outright lie?

Yes, because unless the 8 inch barrel is full of porting and the 12 inch has no porting at all, when you switch from an 8 inch to a 12 inch, the velocity will go down.

[SpecialBlend2786]

Hear's the real question....

Anyone yet seen any actual 'proof' that they even spin the paintball at all?

nope

[Duzzy]

Yes, because unless the 8 inch barrel is full of porting and the 12 inch has no porting at all, when you switch from an 8 inch to a 12 inch, the velocity will go down.

Well since I never said my example was correct, it was only intended as an example and the question still stands...

However, since you were so kind as to point out my mistake, and since I never gave specifics the 8 inch barrel is so full of porting there is hardly any metal in it and the 12 inch is either a Javelin or a Lapco barrel.

[Arson51]

...wow... I gotta say yall know how to slam a company and the good name of people you dont even know nor have never met...good job...


Colin, the actual owner of Hammerhead as well as Offical Paintball of Texas and their various lines of products is a standup guy and cool as hell... YOU dont know him YOU damn sure shouldnt be bashing him like you guys are... not cool

NOW... the barrels, I personally prefer kits with a short control barrel, IE hammerheads, stiffis, etc... I will also say I have converted sevral people over the years to my way of thinking, I know yall are set in your ways and are all over Newton and everyone else who has ever done some sort of testings balls and me throwing a couple paragraphs of text that may or may not go against some of this prolly isnt going to change this...but I feel the need to stick up for one of my sponors who is getting bashed for the simple fact his barrels seem to go against what YOU have been told for years online...

So, Ive seen the progression of these barrels over the years, shot on every gun on the market practicly, with just about every brand of paint as well... Im not here to say they add x ammount of range, and always shoot perfect through paint and crap... cuz they dont stright up...

I am here to say they are sweet barrels that are more forgiving on not so great paint, have a constant tragectory at both short and long distances, less down range sound(not that it matters to much, but for those that think it does, and its just plain cool LOL) It DOES shoot ok through breaks, better then most(new gen battle stik expecially)

Specifics: well honed short bore= less distance for warped/dimpled paint to hangup and bust, less chops .... Preformance loss, nothing nominal, it has the seal needed and thats it, very well machined short control bore... If you want to say my above thoughts on that are bs, back it up saying you have PERSONALLY used both with the same paint, same gun, same paint to bore match....if not then DFT

Rifleing: Added physical distance? Not really nominal, but it does look like it... The way the tips are designed with a larger diamater and a very minimal twist with the rifleing DOES seem to stableize the ball at all ranges, but namely across the field. As a backplayers, every edge I can get, Im going to utilize and with the Hammerhead its a fairly decent edge when trying to put balls on someones face from 180esh feet away. I cant even say this is all due to the rifleing, the muzzle break doesnt have rifleing on it with the battle stik, and has an even larger diamiter, which is claimed to recharge the residual pressure behind the ball... Now for the physic minded people here, lets look at the pillow effect of the low pressure guns that the air has behind the ball(this is the stuff that makes your marker still shoot paint and not blow it to hell if your LPR fails, generally puting your FPS in thigh mid 500s, still leaving the ball intact and shooting really really fast(ie through a pod full of paint, a pack, and into someones back) and then logicly(as flawed as you may claim it to be) would stand to say the barrels design utlizes this... I have noticed LP markers getting more out of the hammerhead then high pressure guns, though they still do get some preformance gain here, and deffently from the short control bore/wider inner diamitater of the barrel...

Converting people to the hammerhead:

Ive had the pleasure of promoteing these barrels over the years, and carry a full fin kit and an extra tip in autococker threading and have got a fair share of people to go out and buy a hammerhead kit after getting them to shoot one for the day... I (as I did here) try to stay away from the card carrying Hammerhead point sheet...and let the barrel speak for it self... The guys at Hammerhead or any of there dealers wil do the same...
One of the more recent instances of this:
I work at a field in North Central Texas, PMI based... The owners son is hardcore evil this, evil that... and truely loves his pipe kit... swares its the best barrel out there has for years... Well he didnt have it at the field one day and was asking around for a good barrel and was shooting some really brittle ultra evil that was slightly swollen and warped and was old... So being the nice guy that I am, sized some of his paint and let him use my spare tip and a fin... He went out and put a hopper through his gun with the hammerhead on it, came back in smileing and all excited... without even plugging the barrel, he noticed a diffrence, only thing I told him is that it was a great barrel and had sized the paint for him and to go shoot faces... In the first set of games, his longball game improved dramaticly and he wasnt chopping like he was with his pipe kit (also sized) or a boomstick he had used before I let him barrow the hammerhead (also no fitting issues with the boomstick, I checked for peice of mind) He seriously noticed a big diffrence and it showed both through his actions on the field and reactions to them... I bet I ended up sending 3 people to Offical to buy a hammerhead that day and almost looseing my barrel LOL





For those not wanting to read my long post(most likely riddled with typos)
F* Smacktalk
Hammerhead barrels do most of what they say, there not perfect and it could very well be dependant on marker variables
Unless you shoot a hammerhead kit for the day, properly sized, preferably along side another kit with properly sized paint, and test it in actual play, not over a chrono or whatever, just play.... If you think the barrel sucks after that, and dont notice anything diffrent in the way it appers to effect balls and your game...THEN you can come up and say something, but if you just want to go on what others have said and base your posts and opinions on poor wording from sales reps and such, you have no right to say ANYTHING...

So, go try the kit, if it doesnt preform in a fasion compareable to what they say...you prolly dont know how to size paint/setup your marker or are too stuck up on what youve been told by everyone else...

Hmm just because you were told it would work, you think it works on the field but you cant prove it in any given sense... its true right?

I did get to use the hammerhead barrel back in 03 when this damned barrel wasnt even on the f'in map and you werent even f'in sponsored by them, it seemed to me the barrel did shoot further but than again he had been telling me his grand plan for an hour before letting me try it. At that very moment i admit for a second i *could* have been bought by the hype for a split second; loving somthing but not being able to say why. But no matter what the hype glamor and glitter make us believe, all things on this world and this part of space are bound by set rules.

So here is my random thought...

Let's just pretend they shoot the gun first with an 8 inch barrel on it. Then they only change the barrel and put a 12 inch on it and shoot it.

So here is my question. Assuming that the gun shoots different distances in this scenario, and assuming this is their test, are they really lying if they say one barrel shoots farther than another?

Because if you create the right scenario the 12 inch barrel may actually shoot farther because the velocity won't be as high with the 8 inch barrel. Sure it may be misleading but is it an outright lie?

Maybe thats what he was refering to, but than again he did blaspheme Newtons teachings....

[Aliens-8-MyDad]

and maybe if you spend $300 on a barrel your brain makes it seem better than it is so you feel better about spending the money on it?

[CodeMA]

Naw, I didnt get a hype speech at anypoint, and again Ive been around hammerhead barrels since before they thought about becomeing mainstream...

Told it works, sure, see it works everytime I step on the field(minus what was mentioned above) wither its on my gun or not...

Aliens, the poll thing that one game when I wasnt even shouldering my gun? heh...balls were still going in the exact same place ball after ball...

as far as proof, I dont think Colin has done any special video/photography yet...

I didnt pay anything for my kit/s... It still shoots quite nicely...shrugs

[WARPED1]

$300 for a barrel?! WTF!? It better be made of gold and studded with gems!

[Paintchucker]

I'll just jump in here real quick and say Armson Rifled Barrels do not create spin nor are they intended too.

Back to your regularly schedule broadcast.

After over a decade and lots of eliminations, it was just my imagination??? ROFLMAO, I guess I could have been using any barrel. I do love my armsons though... They just "seemed" to be more accurate but the testing was hardly scientific...

[Automaggot68]

I thought you wouldn't do that? You don't care what people think. And you keep on messing up one thing...they wern't argueing because of opinions...he corrected someone who was blatently lying.



Try telling that to Isaac Newton. Why didn't you test the stuff before you call it opinion? You have contradicted yourself more than I care to quote as of now.



According to the first post it was a combination of both of them that drove away the custom...have you ever heard "It takes two to tango"?



It's basic knowlege that it doesn't matter how long the barrel is. It is what velocity the paintball has when leaving the barrel. You are one of those people that believe the earth is still flat arn't you?


-Josh

P.S. I wouldn't take sides if I were you if "You don't have proof".

Aren't you taking sides?

[Miscue]

he was quick to answer "NO you are wrong i went to engeneering school blah blah....the longer barrel has more distance to accelerate the ball thus it has more inertia! blah blah blah Thats why a tiny bullet can kill some one because of inertia!"

Hurm. Inertia does not increase nor decrease based on the acceleration or velocity, if you leave relativity out of the picture. For a paintball to gain inertia, it must gain mass... as they are directly related with each other. That's an interesting trick that these Hammerheads can accomplish... there's some people at Los Alamos National Laboratory that might want to take a look at it.