wow this thread really went this direction.
sad.
Ranger, just let things roll off
RKM 3D Designs
wow this thread really went this direction.
sad.
Ranger, just let things roll off
Registered User
Wow......just wow....... What a sad turn to what started out as a great topic.
Haters Gonna Hate
NC miata, engine bolts on, street tires, and some aftermarket suspension .... smoking 997 turbos/GT3s without issue .... an insane under 8 minute lap time, with traffic.
SKILL
holy smokes, just flat out, petal to the metal, cookin that little 2 liter ...
Last edited by cockerpunk; 02-23-2016 at 10:29 PM.
"because every vengeful cop with a lesbian daughter, is having a bad day, and looking for someone to blame"
KNDE
Powerful enough for my requirements.
Flying the unfriendly skies.
Custom Automag parts
"skill".......yawnOriginally Posted by cockerpunk
Nobody's Perfect
Without looking at the video, i will say that it is an unfair assumption. The miata might be doing a hot lap, where the other cars might be testing the track cor conditions, or 1st time out, or cold tires or even on a cool down lap. That doesn't mean that the Porsches that he is "dusting" are doing the same. If i am in my Hyundai doing 80mph, i will certainly pull away a Corvette doing 50mph, regardless of the horsepower.
Nice try Gordo...
Registered User
No matter if the other guys were not going for it as aggressively as this guy. Fact is: a lap-time of less than 08:00 in a car like a Miata (pretty much any road-legal car) is freakin' fantastic! Here is a list of the fastest "road-legal" cars on the Nordschleife... This Miata is smokin' fast
Haters Gonna Hate
you should try watching the video
also a 7:58 in traffic really speaks for itself. if you are not familar with nurbergring times, look up just how quick a 7:58 really is ... FYI, a porsche 918 spyder only did it a minute faster with a pro-driver, clear traffic, perfect conditions, once.
indeed, the driver is pagani's head test driver, hes fantastic. he has a whole series of these videos, all in the low 8s, high 7s, on the ring, so he can do it consistently with the NC, not like it was a freak one-off hot lap and conditions.No matter if the other guys were not going for it as aggressively as this guy. Fact is: a lap-time of less than 08:00 in a car like a Miata (pretty much any road-legal car) is freakin' fantastic! Here is a list of the fastest "road-legal" cars on the Nordschleife... This Miata is smokin' fast
Last edited by cockerpunk; 02-29-2016 at 11:32 AM.
Haters Gonna Hate
Registered User
Now we are talking. Looks great.
Powerful enough for my requirements.
Hebrews 13:8
Got an extra 2.6 million ?
Custom Automag parts
I watched a little bit of that video...I thought that was your cockerpunk. Im just not into it....pretty boring. Its just a little 2L turd car driving fast through gradual turns. The only thing going on there is the guy has enough balls to go that fast.
Its just not my thing...
Remember...........theres no replacement for displacement....and twin turbos....and carbon brakes....LMAO
being a good driver is a given but you also need a car that isnt a freakn crappy ford escort or in that class of cars....IF YOUR GONNA GO, GO BIG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Last edited by Xmagterror; 03-01-2016 at 11:23 AM.
Registered User
The Nurburgring is a public toll road, believe it or not. Because of this you'll get drivers from an assortment of skill levels. The Porsche guy could be just some old dentist thats never raced and wants to take a few scenic laps without getting himself into trouble. Despite it being a public toll road, its probably the most expensive road to wreck or break down on so I totally understand an inexperienced driver not wanting to push beyond their limits.
I've seen enough spec Miata to know the benefits. They are lightweight rear wheel drive cars that handle well and can be bought for under $2k. Therefore you can drive them all out with no regard to wrecking. I heard a quote that spec Miata was the closest to real life gran turismo. Just watch a race, people bump pass and inadvertently cut corners on the grass. Nobodies going lethally fast so they can play oversized cart racing.
Miata's aren't fast, they are disposable so they can be driven faster then you probably should.
Nobody's Perfect
I do know what the Nordschlife is and how some people drive on it. The open track days to the close ciurcut track to the actual race days. Whether its a a 1960's VW bug that you bought for $50, or you have a loaded prostreet racer that you want to tackle one of the greatest tracks in motorsports history.
Haters Gonna Hate
being a good driver is not a given.
i've never seen someone who only ever drove on the street, who could even reach 75% of the cars potential without serious seat time and education. being a good drive is NEVER a given.
thats why its awesome to watch a truly great driver in action. its skills worship, not wealth worship.
OldPBNoob
Interesting thread. My only disagreement, mainly because I don't care about any of the other crap, is that the terms "car guy" and "fast car" are not necessarily one and the same. I consider myself a bit of a car guy, but my interests lay mainly in vintage VWs. Not fast by any means, in most cases, but they are in fact cars and I am very interested in them making me a car guy. I also like drooling over old muscle cars, high end exotics and the like, but I do not drive a fast car so I guess Im out of this thread. lol.
Registered User
I'm a car guy but don't drive a fast car either. I mean high 13's low 14's in the 1/4 was factory fast 15 years ago but it's pretty par for most family sedans now.
I'll be dragging it around cones at a low speed in a few months so I guess I can convince myself it's fast, lol.
I definitely see the fun in fast motorized vehicles as I've owned some in the past, they are just a little out of my price range and time commitment right now. My dream car is still the CTS-V wagon even if it's not made anymore.
Last edited by boo; 03-04-2016 at 12:22 PM.
OldPBNoob
Agreed. Narrowing the definition of "car guy" only to those who are capable of building or have enough money to buy a 9-10 second car makes it more of a "who's is larger" contest than a thread truly about finding out who are fellow enthusiasts. I'm sure this was more about the OP wanting to show off his admittedly very nice cars than really giving a rats rear end about finding fellow enthusiasts. And see my list of dream cars don't even include a 10 second car. Porsche 356 roadster, 69 convertible Firebird, long list of vintage VW's. I'd love one of those Caddies so I could sell it and buy 2-3 of the cars on my list. Lol.
Registered User
I don't disagree with the premise, and am defending it for the purpose of debate since this thread has already been bastardized. I wish it hadn't been bastardized as there were some cool fast cars and a lot of slow cars posted that belong to random strangers not on the board.
I think we all know the difference between fast cars, slow cars driven fast, and cars that are cool/fun.
Perhaps you guys should start other car/bike threads to show off as well. Nothing wrong with liking and showing off all sorts of vehicles and respecting different vehicles for what they are. It's not about inadequacy, it's a about what floats your boat.
Haters Gonna Hate
its wealth worship. a lot of car culture is actually just wealth worship cammoed as car culture.
i do respect folks who build it themselves, but the honest answer, is that anyone can go out and pay someone else to build it for them. wrenching is a skill for sure, but its also a skill you can pay for. and if your serious about it, thats what you do, esp on a modern performance car. you go pay a shop to build you your 1200hp Nissan GTR (i know several people who have them). impressive cars sure, but its just money, its a love of and respect for money, not of cars.
super cars fall into this category for me. i really frankly don't care about anything beyond the z06/GT3 style car. why? because whats the point? if bolting a set of good performance tires on a mr2 means you need to do double the speed-limit to have fun on the street, a super car, you will never EVER touch the limits of it on the street. so you say, take it to the track right? well nope. my friend with a 650S took it to the track and pussy footed it around the track for a week, said it scared the **** out of him, not because of the speed, but because of the risk, he is driving around what you or I could buy a house for, your damn sure not gonna take 250 grand around a corner at beyond 10/10ths ... no way. ever.
I told him to buy a z06 and a ton of track time. WAY better use of 250 grand than a mclaren. when you stuff it, you buy another one.
so whats the point of a super car? the only thing i can think of, is wealth worship. i mean you go to cars and coffee and just listen to the folks looking at the super cars, listen to what they say. the kids all want the posters and can quote the HP and 0-60 times, and will stats race them. and the adults, oh they are the funniest "i wonder what his wife looks like?" "wow, his house must be ...."
its just wealth worship.
the far more interesting cars at cars and coffee is the little TR4, kind a junky, but the dude has owned it since he was 17, and took his wife of 45 years on there first date with it. thats a car. thats what makes them cool.
but thats why driving is far more respectable to me. because you can't pay for it, you can't fake it, and you can't BS it. it is in you. and it can't be taken away, and it can't be bought. thats why watching a miata on some suspension flying around the nerbergring is so much better than EVERY SINGLE 1000+ HP GTR build. because that skill, can't be bought.
its fundamentally a doing versus owning thing for me. is it more fun to own something, or is it more fun to do something? its always more fun to do something IMO.
Last edited by cockerpunk; 03-04-2016 at 02:10 PM.
Registered User
Says the guy who spends a couple hundred for a few hours around a track so he can come back here and brag about his skills.
Track racing is the same wealth worship you claim to hate x10. The fast guys are the ones that don't have to work for a living and can pay for a car and hauler and hit up every track in an scca series.
It's incremental, and unless your wealthy your skill is only incrementally better then a person that's never done a track day. Your skill will be vastly behind anyone that has the time and money to do track days frequently across the country.
It's definitely not for everyone for the main points you mentioned. Your only as good as the car you can afford to ball up on the track or break in the kitty litter.
So if I might be able to afford a fast car and enjoy it. But I probably won't be able to ever afford a fast car that I can afford to destroy.
Putting people down for having nice cars that they can't afford to track is pretty lame and hypocritical. Not everyone wants to drive a Miata around town.
Last edited by boo; 03-04-2016 at 03:43 PM.
OldPBNoob
I don't care about the rest of your post so I'll leave that to someone else. I agree some aspects of car culture are geared around wealth but there is a much bigger trend over the last decade or so being more accepting of daily drivers, rat rods etc. Again my only real beef was with the statement indicating you had to have a 10 second car to be a car guy. I work on and maintain my 64 bug. I've taken it from barely running with hit or miss electricals to a fun little car that I drive as often as I can. Loving cars isn't just about wanting to go fast. I enjoy tinkering with them. Kind of like I enjoyed tinkering with paintball markers.
Haters Gonna Hate
i have never bragged about my skills.
money always matters, and yes, more money buys more track time. so what? thats like a weekend rec player arguing hes as good at paintball as a pro player who plays 3 or 4 times a week to stay good. so what? all that matters is the results, and thats being a better paintball player or driver. better to spend you money doing something, than owning something. i am more worried about the guy with a mid end setup who is at the field every weekend, than someone who bought the top of the line setup and plays twice a year. money is a constraining resource, better to spend it on learning and growing skills, than buying things.
i have put no one down.
Last edited by cockerpunk; 03-04-2016 at 04:29 PM.
Registered User
OK.. I have left this thread for the most part since it got bastardised. But to compare the normal track day guy or normal racer with the money grab aspect is crap. I know people that race in dragbike shootout professionally. Guess what. They work there butts off all year. Spend very little on anything except the bike. Have an old enclosed trailer they haul there bike in and live in a house that probably costs less than the bike. They don't have much money. They scrimp by to fund there passion.
My buddy that roadraces is an engineer. Makes decent money. But again. Cheap harbor freight trailor behind his little VW. All his money goes to his single racebike that he keeps license on so he can convert it back to street trim.
There is lots and lots of track days and racing that are not about tons of money.
As for bike and car culture. I'm for all aspects. As long as you don't claim my likes don't count we will get along fine. There will for sure be ribbing and harassment going on though.
Registered User
We are on a board where people build awesome $1000+ markers to often times bring it out once or twice a year. Sometimes they only see a backyard and a few hoppers. And you know what? There's nothing wrong with that.
This thread is like the paintball threads where someone shows off a cool electro or mag and then someone rips it for being a wallhanger and brags about their clapped out tippman that they play with more then you.
Haters Gonna Hate
yup. except i ripped on no ones cars.
car culture is 99% MCB/AO "look at what i built arnt a forum cool!" thats what car shows are, thats what meets are, thats what "build threads" are. but unlike paintball, where that is probably overall the minority of people involved in paintball (most folks want to PLAY paintball, i know, crazy thought), the vast vast vast vast majority of "car people" are this way. they think car culture IS car shows, is forum culture, is freeway pulls ... this is just what they think car culture is. its like if MCB just was paintball for folks, no local fields, just a BST and forums and the whole culture that breeds.
someone logs on finally and says "hey, you should try going and actually playing paintball" and somehow this is the crazy person ....
Registered User
Uh isn't that what MCB is? I'll bet you half the members there have not played paintball within the last year. And when they do finally play they usually ***** about it.
And that's perfectly OK. There are some members markers that I would think it is crazy to play with. If I had the disposable income I would own a few markers so collectable they would only see hoppers in my backyard.
Just because someone has a fast car or a cool marker doesn't mean you should look down on them for not using it at the track or on the field.
OldPBNoob
You're comparing apples and oranges. The restoration/collecting aspect of car culture is just as much a part of the car culture as is racing. I have zero interest in racing or building a race car. As others have said, just because you think it's essential to want to race to be part of the "culture" doesn't make it true. Thats like saying you have to wrench on your own car to be a "real car guy". Not true. Different strokes for different folks. Some drive, some build, some collect, some admire. All different facets of the same culture.
Haters Gonna Hate
fast cars are for driving.
paintball equipment is for playing paintball with.
this isn't a crazy idea.
Last edited by cockerpunk; 03-07-2016 at 11:28 AM.
Registered User
For you. Other people see fast cars as a fun way to get to work or haul groceries. Other people are perfectly content building up a killer custom marker to adorn the walls of their man cave. Or a car to show off in a show or a parking lot. Personally I like building markers for the fun of the build, I prefer to play with off the shelf factory stock markers. What you think is normal might not be for other people.
I recently bought a moderately fast daily driver. It's my commuter car so it will never see a track, but I'll throw it around an autocross course. If I have disposable income again I'll build a car purely for fun. Either an old 90s merc E class convertible with a big engine swap or an old American muscle car convertible. No need to track a floppy bodied convertable, but they sure are fun to cruise on the highway on a nice day.
Last edited by boo; 03-07-2016 at 11:47 AM.
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