Project path decision?!

[Merce]

Need some help deciding what path to take on a project I've had for YEARS now and just finally decided to finish it. I had it almost completed and decided to scrap the entire thing and keep only the body and a trigger...

Few things I need to know before I can truly decide which path to take:
I know I want an Armada rail. But can't decide which length. I want this to be a sleeper so I would either get the RTP length and Lukes LPR grip or (more preferably) the shorter version(if I can hunt one down) with a short angled VD foregrip. The latter would require an lpr within the grip frame. Can this be done to a LC mini vert? And what ASAs would I be limited to? I reeeeally want to avoid a CP. Would much rather stick with either a DP raps or PE pops. Is this at all plausible? Frame would be either Tslot or dovetail milled depending. What alternatives would there be other than a different foregrip or inner frame lpr?

Other questions:
What is the LC ult mod?
What is needed for a UTB or similar build?

[OPBN]

For a sleeper mod with a hidden LPR, you are somewhat limited to direct mount ASA adapters.

[Merce]

I take it that its mostly because of how the oring needs to be sandwiched between the asa and the frame to avoid leakage right?

[OPBN]

Yes. Typically on a sleeper, there is a hole drilled in the top of the ASA and the LPR is screwed into the inside of the frame. Air from the top of the asa flows into the LPR. Has to be a good seal on both the LPR threads and between the ASA and bottom of the frame. With an LC frame, it may be possible, but would be super tight. Maybe you would be a good candidate for one of Lukes OLTRs. Buy his LPR foregrip and one of his frames and go to it.

[Merce]

Hmm think it'd be plausible to drill/tap another hole coming out of the side of the frame for a macroline fitting? Which would pretty much make a U fitting

[OPBN]

Hmm think it'd be plausible to drill/tap another hole coming out of the side of the frame for a macroline fitting? Which would pretty much make a U fitting

I personally think it would be ghettotastic, but anything's possible. Why not just go with a CP? Another option is a BL gear drive. The latter is harder to get to seal up, but still doable.

[Merce]

I personally think it would be ghettotastic

Haha! Sounds decent in my head. Will probably have to draw it up before I decide anything definitively. Would definitely use a pair of the ccm low pro fittings

[Grelvire]

Zeropjc has an Armada rail in the FST section

https://www.automags.org/forums/showt...s-lot-sell-out

[Merce]

Bought it. Thanks grelvire!

[Merce]

So I saw a build by mpsd the other day(his alien mag) and loved the epneu but noticed that I don't believe I've seen a lot of other epneus out there? How come? Are they just difficult without that skill set? Are there people out there that could help?

[Pneumagger]

It will look ghettotastic (especially if you don't have a mill) if you do a short U-fitting thing. It will not be a sleeper to anyone that knows about pneumatic mags.

I did a sleeper frame for someone once that used a short dovetail mount (CP rail I think) and then the ASA mount that went onto the dovetail mount. Iforget the ASA type, but it doesn't matter too much because the air was transmitted by a 1/4-28" piece of steel allthread that I bored out hollow. The internal hole of the male NPT on the LPR and then the top of ASA were drilled and tapped for 1/4-28". The dovetail rail was drilled out 5/16" and then everything was assembled; sealing the straight threads with thread seal compound. It more or less made the ASA/frame combo permanent and was a bit ghetto in that regard, but it was completely hidden.



I really just reccomend a CP Direct mount and WGP internal LPR-nut adapters. These are WGP internal LPR-nut adapters next to a G-Force frame that I installed an LPR with. They make mounting an LPR in a solid bottom frame much nicer. Plus if you ever remove the LPR, the frame doesn't look like it was violated (too badly).



A slightly easier, stealthy, and way cooler way to do an LPR is a vertical grip LP reg. It hides the reg in plain sight. Check it out. At that point, it doesn't matter what grip you use too because there is no "LPR" to hide. The ASA is modified to pass the LP through a top hose and the reg gets modified to create <100psi but still pass HP out the side. This is (was?) my pneumag. I still have all the parts, but I'd have to miraculously find all the parts packed away to reassemble it. Notice the gauge on the ASA is a 0-100psi LP gauge.

[Pneumagger]

Also, I designed the Airwalk frame and also built MPSD's Epneu frame for him.

Epneus work alright, buy are very cramped and (IMO) can be tricky to get all the settings right. I think that's because you have to not only adjust setting electronically, you have to play with you LPR pressure as well as adjust a ULT. Change one variable and the others might need adjusted too. I don't know... maybe it's because I just never spent a bunch of time to really dial one in but they do seem to rip when well adjusted. I just prefer the better flowing RT on/off and a mech 3-way.

[Merce]

Yeah I've decided against my ghettotasticness for now, as well as worrying about sleepering it. But I'm still very interested in an epneu setup. Do you still do them pneumagger?

[Pneumagger]

Not much free time nowdays, sorry.

[Merce]

Know of any how to resources around?

[Pneumagger]

Depending on your frame, if you want to do an electro and hide the lpr, consider one of Luke's foregrop options. Not many grips can hide an lpr and battery... And even then you might have to put a small board in the rail.

[Merce]

Who can mill a umf frame to fit a pancake noid for me?

[Spider-TW]

Who can mill a umf frame to fit a pancake noid for me?

Beware of that road. Most of the successful solenoid-only-mags have been constructed from frames designed to hold and power larger solenoids, like the spyder frames and hyper frames. In theory, a smaller solenoid can trip a ULT, but there's not much room for sticky o-rings or low batteries.

[Merce]

Beware of that road. Most of the successful solenoid-only-mags have been constructed from frames designed to hold and power larger solenoids, like the spyder frames and hyper frames. In theory, a smaller solenoid can trip a ULT, but there's not much room for sticky o-rings or low batteries.

That's why I'm asking. I certainly do not have the profciency to do any of that myself. I have been doing a lot of research and might have found the solution to not needing to mill a space for the larger noid at the top. And on that note, any one know how the force of an 98s noid is compared to the spyder noids?

[Pneumagger]

Spyder Noids can fit in UMF frames pretty well if you mill the frame out for it. They are also cheap and plentiful. The grips have to be hollowed out a little bit though as well. The real space constraint is the Capacitor. If you can fit the Board up inside the rail, that makes it a bit easier.

[Merce]

If you can fit the Board up inside the rail, that makes it a bit easier.

Got an example picture of this?? I'd assume it'd have to be small like a utb or something

[sjrtk]

Merce,

Be for you cut into the frame contact P8ntbal4me here. IIRC he may still have the cads for cutting the solenoid pocket in a UMF. But if you are gonna attempt it I have a pnue'd UMF that I would trade with you be for cut a clean UMF.

[correia3]

Merce,

Be for you cut into the frame contact P8ntbal4me here. IIRC he may still have the cads for cutting the solenoid pocket in a UMF. But if you are gonna attempt it I have a pnue'd UMF that I would trade with you be for cut a clean UMF.

I think luke did or was going to do the milling for p8nt so he may be able to help also. P8nt would also be a good source for questions regarding the electronics. He really knows his stuff.

[Merce]

Merce,

Be for you cut into the frame contact P8ntbal4me here. IIRC he may still have the cads for cutting the solenoid pocket in a UMF. But if you are gonna attempt it I have a pnue'd UMF that I would trade with you be for cut a clean UMF.

Thank you. I planed on trading with pneumagger though. I may have to follow up on the P8ntbal4me reference though.

I think luke did or was going to do the milling for p8nt so he may be able to help also. P8nt would also be a good source for questions regarding the electronics. He really knows his stuff.

Pneumagger has been helping me the most with regards to electronics but once again I'll have to check with P8nt for more perspectives as well. And also Luke possibly. though I think I've been bugging him a lot lately lol.

Speaking of Luke's customs, I read earlier about a UMF frame on a am/mm rail with a foregrip via one of Luke's foregrip extenders. Does anybody have any pictures of how this would look? It was an old post with inactive photo links :/ OH! also on the not of foregrips, how would one go about cutting down the length of a carbon fiber tube?(ie the cf tube of a dw fg, 1st gen)

[Pneumagger]

If I were putting a UMF on an AM/MM rail, I'd use a CCI Phantom VSC angled ASA for the foregrip - just modify the frame and ASA to work together. I'm not a fan of the foregrip extender look... at that point just get the longer rail.

If you want to put a board in the rail, I think it'd almost have to be a RTP rail. A UTB is small, but has sort of a thick connector so it might not fit into a rail. I literally just asked for a stock ION board from the PBN WTB forums and got one for free. I stripped the switch, Cap, and solenoid... relocated the switch and cap into the frame with wires and stuck the ion board in the rail. I positioned the ION button behind one of the holes already in the RTP rail so you could turn it on by poking the button through the hole - lol.

This is an EP Mag, but the ION board is in the rail:
http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g4...s/480874da.jpg
http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g4...s/Picture3.jpg
http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g4...Picture276.jpg

Or you could just go crazy with the mill and make more board space behind the battery:
http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g4.../Picture11.jpg

IMO, going pneumatic is probably easier but slightly more costly and there will be more tuning involved.
Going with a sear tripping solenoid will take more work fitting and cutting, but should be a little more trouble free.

[Merce]

If I were putting a UMF on an AM/MM rail, I'd use a CCI Phantom VSC angled ASA for the foregrip - just modify the frame and ASA to work together. I'm not a fan of the foregrip extender look... at that point just get the longer rail.

The vsc just has it mounted to the trigger frame right? Pretty similar to that logic ripper on the what's it worth thread if I'm correct. Its hard trying to figure out some of the layout stuff when I'm still waiting on the actual items to get here.

[Pneumagger]

yes. I have both a VSC kit at home and a UMF. I can see how involved it might be if nobody else already knows.

[Pneumagger]

How about these:



Trigger MicroSwitch Slot and Second Hole For Solenoid Bottom Block:


Solenoid Pocket:

[Merce]

That'll definitely be useful later on. Thank you pneu

[sjrtk]

Thank you. I planed on trading with pneumagger though. I may have to follow up on the P8ntbal4me reference though.

Hey no problem just wanted to make sure the option was out there.